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Talk:Marlein Selbrech
Noble/Knight So I'm confused. Ser is the equivalent of a knight ie Ser Cauthrien or Ser Gilmore, but this article refers to her as a noble, which doesn't make since as knights serve a noble family and do not hold titles of nobility. Is there a reference for her being a noble, or does this need to be changed? --''--Isolationistmagi'' 03:05, March 22, 2012 (UTC) :Err, it occurred to me that Ser is "messere", a way to address someone politely, just as "Serah"... Why do you think it means "a knight"? PS: See here. Asherinka (talk) 09:10, March 22, 2012 (UTC) :: Prior to DAII I can't recall seeing "messere" or "serah" anywhere, and "ser" in and of itself within DAO was used exclusively in reference to knights unless my memory fails me. This brought me to the conclusion that "ser" was synonymous with "Knight" within the DAverse, regardless of the meanings of the word in other contexts. Thus when "messere" and "serah" appeared in DAII, I recognized them as similar but distinct entities from "ser" in DAO, owing to the fact that they were often applied to nobles such as Hawke, but never in my recollection to a knight. Similarly, I don't think I've ever seen a noble referred to as "ser" within the DAverse until reading this page. Granted my memory might be failing me here, but that's at any rate the reason why I take "ser" to mean knight. --''--Isolationistmagi'' 19:53, March 22, 2012 (UTC) :::We have a bunch of templars in Kirkwall, all of whom are called Ser (Ser Thrask, Ser Cullen, Ser Karras etc). We also have i.e. Evangeline called Ser Evangeline in Asunder (and she is a female). In Asunder Leliana calls a young templar "young ser", and Evangeline calls a simple guard in the town of Velun "ser". All of these instances seem to contradict your assumption. I think serah is simply more polite than ser, but ser does not necessarily refer to a knight. Asherinka (talk) 20:02, March 22, 2012 (UTC) :::: Cullen's official title is "Knight Captain", but is also referred to as "ser", which could indicate some interchangeability in at least the lower templar ranks. However, that sounds like a bit of a stretch even to me. As for the example of the guard, I have nothing to say against that. Therefore I'll concede the point unless of course something more concrete comes up that supports my view. --''--Isolationistmagi'' 20:28, March 22, 2012 (UTC) ::::: I can't find any explanation what Ser means on BSN, but I found this re serah/messere: "Both are gender-neutral forms of address used in the Free Marches. "Serrah" is common usage, something you'd call an equal (or someone of lesser status). "Messere" is a term of respect." © Gaider ::::: I don't know, may be all templars are considered to be knights, and Evangeline was over-polite with the guard? And yet we have this Ser Marlein Selbrech.. *shrugs* Asherinka (talk) 20:32, March 22, 2012 (UTC) :::::: From the official guide for Dragon Age: Origins, "ser" is used to denote knighthood (male and female). Most knights are nobles, but they are not necessarily nobles. So Ser Marlein Selbrech would be considered a noble and a knight. However, I don't know if "ser" is only for knights, and it's possible that templars are considered knights in Ferelden (they do have the word "Knight" in their name sometimes, like Knight-Commander, so it may not be far-fetched). I suppose it is possible that people misuse the honorific to anyone who wields a sword. --'D.' (talk · ) 21:02, April 14, 2012 (UTC) ::::::According to World of Thedas (page 47) knights are indeed part of the minor nobility and are addressed as "Ser". However that is about Ferelden, not the Free Marches. In this case, Marlein Selbrech is indeed a minor noble. 10:00, September 19, 2013 (UTC)